Primarily Petroliana Shop Talk Forums Shop Talk Petroliana Forums General Petroliana Discussion Visible Pumps-Dry vs Wet delivery time periods

What is likely the earliest year visible pumps started to move from a dry hose system to a wet hose system?
Service stations flipped order of gallon markers(0-10gal) and converted to wet hose system( 10gal-0) utilizing a newer squeeze nozzle handle.

Do we know when the squeeze nozzles were first being sold into the market?

I would guess mid-1920s...my Fry 117 is dry hose and I think it came out around 1923. My American 2347 came out around 1927 and it's wet hose. Sorry I can't be more precise than that.

I'm lost. I have 3 visible and I'm not understanding the wet/dry thing. My understanding was fill the cyl Use what was needed (drained from cyl) and what was left over went back into the storage below(drain line to tank)

Dry hose = cylinder starts empty (lower numbers on bottom, higher on top), customer pumps whatever gas they want to buy into cylinder and drains it into the car. Cylinder is usually "dry" unless someone is buying gas.

Wet hose = Cylinder remains full between customers (lower numbers on top, higher on bottom) and customer drains however much fuel they want from the full glass cylinder down to the level they want to buy. Cylinder is "wet" because it always contains fuel that is ready for purchase.

At least this is my understanding of it.

I think you done pretty well Brian. DB explained it to me something like this. As roads improved and autos improved You could cover more area in a given time. Thats when dry hose models was converted to wet hose system as customer wanted more fuel on board. But the sad part he never gave a time frame. So I'm not much help with your question. He would give me a answer that was basic food for thought. Sure miss that guy!

My Roman is dry hose and has Zero at top & 10 at bottom. Ascending or descending numbers is not a factor in wet/dry delivery.

Wet/Dry depends on which end of the hose the shut off is located. With dry hose, the shut off is at the base of the cylinder and used the "banana" nozzle. The hose is dry at beginning and end of fuel delivery. Wet hose will have a shut off incorporated in the nozzle. The hose is wet (full) at the beginning and end of fuel delivery.

What Morgan said!

Love this forum. I have a 1927-28 visible that has 0 gallon marker on top, 10 bottom of cylinder w/gate valve, but no hose. Questions as I close in on re-assembly and ordering a brass nozzle and cloth hose.

Curious if stations w/ visible started with a gate valve/dry hose set up and at some point switched for consumer ease the shutoff at fuel nozzle vs gate valve.
Would a gas station owner/operator take time to reverse gallon markers if they did switch over from wet to dry set up? My guess is perhaps not.

It does seem reasonable that bottom 0 and top 10 markers seem to make since for a dry set up(gate valve). Attendant/User filled up to the gallon mark they wanted, open the gate valve and emptied gas level in cylinder& hose fuel volume into the car/truck. 10 at bottom and 0 at top seems reasonable that you always filled cylinder 'full' between customers when the nozzle was squeezed, empty fuel to the desired level and released the nozzle trigger. Pay for what you poured.

I'm not trying to start a ***** contest on which is correct. Only curious on the historical accuracy of this hobby and then deciding if I put a nozzle/shutoff and orientation of markers.
Perhaps there are high rez pictures on the net that might show gallon marker orientation and nozzle types.
Also patent research on early nozzles with shut off valve integrated.

Thank you all for the info above.

Found a cool website. http://www.gaspumpnozzles.com/McDonald.html
Shows a McDonald Type M Nozzle and referenced in a 1928 catalog.
Either nozzle type would have been used well into the late 20's.
Nice.

I have some thoughts to your question. 1st mom and pop store selling gas more than likely could of bought a second hand pump other than factory new may not have change numbers,and not went to wet hose as quick as large chain stations. Large chain stations had attendants you didn't pump your gas. They also had pump service guys that came around and serviced pumps and up dated pumps. Either way is correct because drys was converted. If your pump has a gatevalve and you believe it to be correct for your pump then it was a dry system. I have a fry 5 gallon with external pump it came from factory dry. Wouldn't change a thing ,I get a kid out of explaining how it worked,and also explain kids walk to school and back.LOL!

So Would with the "To Car and To Storage" pointer on a G&B 177 need a gate valve for a banana nozzle ?

Thank you for the info Loyd. Yes, agree and will now stick with the original gate value and search for an early banana style nozzle.
Looking at the gallon markers and orientation this evening. Seems either way 0-10 or 10-0 could work for a dry hose delivery set up.
From a historical perspective, do find the question interesting.

The orientation of the gallon numbers simply means the cylinder was full or empty at the beginning of the transaction. With zero at top, the cylinder was filled to capacity before delivery. With zero at bottom, the cylinder was filled only with the number of gallons the customer requested.

Morgan, 100% agree with your statement after looking at my 10 gal cylinder put back together w/ gallon markers installed.
Much easier to visualize vs. looking at a bunch of disassembled parts on the ground.

I've been thinking about this gallon marker orientation issue for a bit. And to me, it makes sense to have the cylinder full before starting with the number 0 thru 10 starting with zero at the top. My reasoning for this is because sometimes you don't really know how much gas your tank is going to hold. If you had it the other way around you may fill the pump cylinder up with 5 gallons and then begin to fill your tank.....only to find out your tank will only hold 2 gallons. Yes you can do it that way but you'll have to do a little math etc. However, with the pump cylinder full before you start to pump it in your jalopy the cylinder level only drains down to the exact amount your tank will hold, and the level of gas left in the cylinder indicates the exact amount of product you are buying on the markers. This is my first post and I hope I'm not embarrasing myself!

Roger