Primarily Petroliana Shop Talk Forums Shop Talk Petroliana Forums General Petroliana Discussion What have I got here??? Old Petrolania Badges???

Hello,
New Poster. Please help. What the %$^* have I got here (see photos that I hope I attached). These items were removed from a 100+ year old auto parts manufacturer in Chicago. They are all steal, round, some curved, painted, auto, oil, or gas related, able to be attached via stud, threaded stud, or retangular post. I have posted 2 items (Esso and Hi-Speed) on eBay #150374760301 eBay Esso and Hi-Speed "Badges"??? for sale .
I look forward to your expert replies.
Take Care,
JDA

Bases on the logos, lack of wear/patina, the "whiteness" of the white, I'm assuming these were made not too long ago.
Not sure what they are for.

Whatever they are, they're pretty cool! Got any with Cities Service on them??

Hey! Has anyone else on here ever seen these types of badges before?? Joe sent me some pics of a Cities Service one and it really intrigues me as to what they were used for?? Here's a comment from Joe: " I do believe they were stored in this factory for years, if not decades, and never saw the light of day. I have had them in my possession for 20 years."
These could be very old pieces but the curved shape on them has me very curious??? How about it Professor, any thoughts??
Joe, if you're reading this, you should post the pics of the badge that you sent to me? It really illustrates what I'm curious about on the curvature!---KEVIN

nice badges joe!!! i`d be interested in the flying A ONE IF YOU SELL..TXS ALAN

How about we try and date them. For instance, when was it that Marathon stopped using the running man? When was the last De Soto made?

Jack Sim

They don't trip my trigger.

I HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS...

HOW BIG? SIZE...DIAMETER ETC?

WHAT ARE THEY MADE OF?

Did they come in the Zip-Loc bags? That packaging looks awfully modern.

???

...there's no way you could convince me that these are old...

Old or not, don't ya just kinda get a little curious when you see something that you've never run across before??? With most stuff, I can easily discern an intended purpose and these are most certainly badges for something but what?? Those curved shapes leave me puzzled??

maybe these are totally fantasy & were never meant for anything, except to sell to people who think they were meant for something.......

...my feelings exactly...

Looks like a lotta work to go thru for a fantasy item? I could understand the fantasy thing if there was some purpose but why bother if theres no end result?? Someone, somewhere made these for a purpose and it looks like it ended there if noones ever seen one in use.

I don't want to offend a new member looking for help...but...the white's seem very white and the graphics really seem to pop.
I'm not confident at this point they are very old. Hopefully someone will read this thread that can shed some light on them.

of course those are modern...

not much work to go thru at all???
first, find these blank buttons used for some other purpose at a swap meet or some industrial sale, garage sale, or numerous other places, buy them cheap paint them white & put a decal or silk screen them for another few pennys.......the fantasy purpose would be to sell them & i see there are a few lined up here on this thread......
money seems like a good purpose to me & what better things to make money with than gas & oil, auto memorabilia...lastly there are some with incorrect logos, wrong colors & i doubt very much if a large company would authorize this......i guess if you think their right, buy em

The look fake (repo) to me.But what do I know.
Joe

Im intrigued. They look new, but also look too well made to be new. Unlike Dick, they tripped my trigger.
John

If they are fake, I would think that more will pop up in the future. If they were found all at one place you I would think that several of one kind or a couple kinds would be found. The fact that um-teen different kinds was found also says fake to me. The WHITE paint should make us all wonder, that's why we are talking about it. But on the other hand, they could have been a prototype of something that someone was trying to sell, and thier plans were to appeal to every company. I cant see to many things that these could of been used for, they would have to of had a purpose.

Are the smaller ones in the first picture thicker-walled than the curved ones in the foreground? Those small ones look a bit like cup plugs ("freeze plugs").

Jack Sim has the right idea. When did that Atlantic logo begin and end? What about that RPM logo?

Wes

Figuring out what these were intended for would probably solve the mystery. Real or Fantasy.

The Marathon Logo was used from 1947 - 1962.

It is not unusual for a company to make a prototype of an item they want to sell to a customer, then have it not sell.
I have seen a number of items that were made for Marathon that for one reason or another were never released.

The number 1 reason for products failing to sell that I have run across, is they got the logo Wrong. (those items are often thrown on a back shelf or store room, never going into full production.)

Chuck

Guys,
Thank you very much for the comments. Being as I know nothing about petroliana, I sincerely appreciate your expertise. I have attempted to post some photos per Kevi's request. I will now try to answer some of the other questions. The baggie packaging is not original. Regarding condition, I am confident these badges have never seen the light of day. They were found in the graphics lab of a 100+ year old factory in Chicago. At a minimum, I can very confidently date them back 25 years. They are attracted to a magnet and slight surface rust is appearing. Small badge is 0.052" material thk, 2 1/2" dia., 7/16 dp, has a 10-32x3/4" long threaded mounting stud (some have 3/32" thk x 1/2" wide x 7/16 long rect. mouting post with 3/16" hole at end). Large domed badge is 0.042" mat. thk, 4.0" dia., 1/8" dp, and has 2) 8-32x7/16" long threaded mounting studs. Large curved badge is 0.026" mat. thk, 4.0" in dia., 1/8" dp (when mounted on mating curved surface) and has 2) 1/8"x9/16" long non-threaded mounting studs. I have approximately 4 different badge styles with approx. 30 different logos. They are being stored in my heated garage. I believe they must have had (an intended) functional purpose. I hope this helps and look forward to your continued replies. Thank you very much.

K. W.,
I'm inclined to agree with you on this. I don't know petroliana, but I do dabble a bit in old stuff that catches my eye at estate sales, auctions, flea markets, etc... After working in the metal manufacturing business for 30+ years, I do believe that's a lot of work put into these "badges". For what, I don't know. There must have been some intended purpose. Otherwise, how did they end up with different sizes, different, shapes, different mounting studs, etc...?

Chuck,

Thanks for the marathon dates. I'm inclined to lean toward your thinking on this. Possibly some sort of prototype that never hit the mass market. And the question remains; what was the intent? What mass market? I have reason to believe these were all made at one factory. Therefore, were all these (badge)companies requesting these? I suspect it was the other way around (as you suggest)and the factory made these looking to sell to the (badge) companies. Thanks.

Alan,

I apologize. I don't know what Flying A means. Is that the Alemite badge(s) you are referring to?

Joe

Wes,

Yes. The smaller "badges" are approximately 1/16" thick (quite solid for the small size) while the larger flanged "badges" are approximately 1/32" thick. The other larger, non-flanged "badges" are approximately right in the middle. Thanks for asking.

Joe

Here's my $.02.
Since they came from the graphics lab of an auto parts factory:

These were leftovers, excess, prototypes, whatever, etc metal pieces.
So what do we do with them? Dress them up and sell them!
They had a graphics lab so they could paint them to their liking.
These do appear to be the swap meet variety. I think the parts themselves predate the paint job.

If they were made for a purpose to sell to those companies, why dont the dates of the logos coincide? Say they made them in 1953, wouldnt they all have circa 1953 graphics? or some not so well known logos? Look in a 50's marketing/supplier catalog.
The logos appear to come straight out of a repo gas parts catalog with the "greatest hits" of logos appearing. The ones that sell.

I would think someone that worked at the factory there would know the answer to their use.

White white graphics, unknown origin, unknown use, mot marked, never seen before- all that tells me to be very suspicious until proven otherwise that they are old and not fantasy items.

I'm not bashing the seller-he has asked our opinion.
Which goes a lot farther than most people-most people would just start selling these until they were called out on them.

I just don't personally believe these are that old/genuine

Mark Standard

Alan was and is talking about the "disk"(?), that has the emblem showing a letter "A" with the wings coming out of it. One is shown in your 3rd photo, the photo that shows the different backs of the "disks". If you have more than one and depending on price, I would also be interested in a "Flying A" disk. I have seen items similar to these back in the 60s-70s in a JC Whitney catalog.

Bob,

Thanks for the reply. Being from Chicago, I recognize that Flying "A" as one of the Alemite (greasing and lubrication) as in Stewart-Warner/Alemite emblems. Is "Flying A" another name for this emblem?

Joe

Bob;
I have seen these before too. But without the logos.
Let us know if you remember.
The oval ones used a clip that pressed on the back to hold them and the one with the long flat piece had a spring attached

But, I'll be danged if I can remember what they were for. ?????
Chuck

Here is a couple images of maps used by The Tide Water Oil Company for their "Flying A" Service Stations.



Click on the photo to make them bigger(trying a new hosting system, I think I like Imageshack better)

Chuck, I believe they were a "grill badge" for American cars. I guess trying to match the MG,Triumph, Austin, etc... grill badges. Never caught on and were dropped from catalogs in mid to late 70s, if I remember correctly.

Sounds logical.
Something I thought about was the distance between the studs. Is it the same as the spacing of the holes in those three part carbonless pads used to write up work orders? If the studs were at 9 and 3 o'clock, would the logo still be aligned to read normally?
I'm not disagreeing with either the prototype or the creative reuse of metal shop leftover theories. It's just that it looks like the prongs are spaced a certain way for a reason.
As for the one with what looks like an electrical plug blade, that one just scares me.

Bob,

Thanks. I learned something new today. I had always associated that red "A" with Alemite. I was wrong. That's why I ask the questions.

Joe

Bob and Chuck,

I think the washer idea makes a lot of sense. Most likely the spring steel, retaining type washer. The ones where once you put it on, it's not coming off except with pliers. Thanks.

Joe

Petro Enthusiast,

Thanks for the reply. Nearly all the large "badges" have the stud on the top and bottom 1-3/8" between centers.(as opposed to left and right). However, I just found 2) 3" "badges" (National and Conoco) in the box that have the 1/8" non-threaded stud left to right about 1-1/8" between centers and about 1/4" below center of "badge".

Joe