Looks like pumps did pretty good at this auction in Boca Raton FL this weekend
http://www.rmauctions.com/AuctionResults...gory=Petroliana
I agree, lot 654, 29 thousand over what auction house placed value. Only takes two,caught up in the bid war !
I saw the auction book on that auction,,, wouldn't know how many dollars this auction brought but it had to be in the many , many, millions... the book was 1-1/2" thick , all glossy pages, , I think the book was $150 and $250 for a bidders number., cars, Wulitzer organs, art, gasoline, etc.. just everything...huge !
My god, they got the best prices for that material alright. The owners must still be jumping up and down. $40,000 for a Wayne 50 display? Need to contact them on some of my doubles and displays.
Hey who was the second bidder as I'll sell my wayne 50 display for 50% off..... today only for $20K....
One must take into account the provenance of these items. The buyer(s) now owns an item that came from the Milhous Museum collection.
I saw the auction book on that auction,,, wouldn't know how many dollars this auction brought but it had to be in the many , many, millions...
The top 10 items alone brought over $13 Million!
$3.3 Mill for the 1912 Olds...
http://www.rmauctions.com/auction-results-overview.cfm?SaleCode=MH12
I agree. I would pay more for a particular item based on provenance. Every piece I have in my collection has a story and I love to share those stories. That's what makes items interesting.
I think it's called respect of history and a willingness of some to pay for it.I'm not talking ebay or "picking & flipping" from anywhere to get something,I'm talking pieces with a documented history of it's source such as pictures of the piece in actual use in the industry.I can personally assure that kind of stuff,top grade or not,will bring top dollar from many collestors.I might add,when and if that stuff is ever offered for sale.
I saw the auction book on that auction,,, wouldn't know how many dollars this auction brought but it had to be in the many , many, millions... the book was 1-1/2" thick , all glossy pages, , I think the book was $150 and $250 for a bidders number., cars, Wulitzer organs, art, gasoline, etc.. just everything...huge !
I made it to that auction to bid on some of the pumps and signs. Came home empty handed, but not for a lack of trying...There were some deep pockets there. As you can tell from the auction results prices were outrageous, but the pieces in the collection were top notch. Didn't hurt for R&M to have the auction down the street from the Concourse de elegance car show hosted by Jay Leno either.
-Paul
I think the area where the auction took place has a lot to do with it and the types of buyers. Many overly restored items.
One must take into account the provenance of these items. The buyer(s) now owns an item that came from the Milhous Museum collection.
[quote=Wes Hague]I saw the auction book on that auction,,, wouldn't know how many dollars this auction brought but it had to be in the many , many, millions...
The top 10 items alone brought over $13 Million!
$3.3 Mill for the 1912 Olds...
PROVENANCE ??? That's very questionable when it comes to gas pumps don't you think ?
Re:Provenance for pumps. A few years ago I had a gentleman approach me stating he had a barn full of his grandfathers items. His grandfather owned a Shell gas station during the 1920's and then his father ran it till the 1960's when they sold it. I purchased the original visible gas pump, old photo's of the pump in use, Coca Cola vending machines. Sales awards from Shell dated 1941 for 25 years of good service and a service award dated 1961 for 45 years of service. Old telephone directories and other advertising from the gas station. A pick-up truck full of shop tools dating back to the 20's. In this particular town there was a fire that destroyed the entire main street in 1922. You guessed it, the only building to survive was the gas station.
How's that for provenance and a story.
The Texaco Fry never looked like that. $9000.00 + ? What you have is a bunch of silly old rich man.
I think it's called respect of history and a willingness of some to pay for it.I'm not talking ebay or "picking & flipping" from anywhere to get something,I'm talking pieces with a documented history of it's source such as pictures of the piece in actual use in the industry.I can personally assure that kind of stuff,top grade or not,will bring top dollar from many collestors.I might add,when and if that stuff is ever offered for sale.
I made it to that auction to bid on some of the pumps and signs. Came home empty handed, but not for a lack of trying...There were some deep pockets there. As you can tell from the auction results prices were outrageous, but the pieces in the collection were top notch. Didn't hurt for R&M to have the auction down the street from the Concourse de elegance car show hosted by Jay Leno either.
-Paul
PROVENANCE ??? That's very questionable when it comes to gas pumps don't you think ?
No, not questionable at all. Read Old Iron's and Redfishhangler's comments. Then, search "Milhous Museum" and educate yourself on the Milhous brothers' collection.
I say "provenance" because the Museum is well publicized and world rennowned for the caliber of cars in it- Concours cars. Which is proven by the high dollar amounts many cars got. The collection is not known for the gas pumps, signs or cans. These items are used as accessories to create a scene/atmosphere to display the cars.
I wasn't there, but I can assume that, aside from the "tire kickers" and gawkers (I don't mean you, Redfishangler), the majority of the people (the bidders) were there to see/bid on the cars and not the gas pumps, signs or cans. The cars are the reason I knew about the auction.
I agree, the prices are a "tad" high for pumps, if sold in the real world, but this isn't the first time, or last, that an auction has brought obscene prices for pumps. Without knowing the backgrounds of who bought the pumps, I am assuming they are "decorators" and/or "provenance" buyers where money is not an issue and they wanted a "piece" from the Museum. I am betting they do not own any of Jack's gas pump books and aren't members of oldgas.com. If they were, surely they would have been educated by now by you- the Pump Police.
The Texaco Fry never looked like that. $9000.00 + ? What you have is a bunch of silly old rich man.
Gilmore
No, not questionable at all. Read Old Iron's and Redfishhangler's comments. Then, search "Milhous Museum" and educate yourself on the Milhous brothers' collection.
Yeah, I'll be sure and do that right after I figure out Lot 636 ? So now I belong to the pump police ? Man gotta love those boys.
Maybe someone else on here should pull up these pumps and enlarge the photos ? If I wanted to educate myself about the Milhous Brothers, I'd probably be on a different forum/website. This is oldgas.com.
What?-Thats a BEAUTIFUL garbage can. Those were probably a bunch of union workers who ran those prices up like that. lol
wouldn't we all like to be that silly and rich ?
I agree 100% with this line of thinking,,, the people buying this stuff are people or companies with bigger things in mind than what is the pump worth and is it over restored, you really have to think outside the box on this auction,,, away outside the box, think of the big picture here..
I think this is all uncalled for chatter. They bought what they liked, it's their money and their choice. Who cares what anyone else thinks.
To belittle them or call them silly names is an indication of who we are and where we are in our lives.
To each their own has been my motto and I respect everyone's right to do as they please as long as it hurts no one and it is moral and ethical.
They earned the money and now they are having fun spending it and at the end of the day they are taking home something nice to display. What's wrong with any of that and all of us quietly dream of living that lifestyle. Isn't that the American dream?
We need more wealthy people to spend their money in this stagnant economy. Do you have any idea, how much money these people spent to come to the auction, how much they spent at restaurants & hotels, car rentals, gifts for their wives, taxi rides, shipping the items. The economic spin-offs are almost uncountable......and all you can do is be critical of them.
I think they have done more for everyone (economically)then you are doing by being so critical and negative.
Enough said (by me)!
I completely agree with Dave Gill's final comments! The original thread was not started for bickering purposes.
There have been many comments made over the last several years asking why veteran collectors do not post, well this post summarizes how this veteran collector feels about this website. I post very little because I don't want the retalitory comments that come from posting.
I strongly feel that most, if not all of the negative posters on this site would not make such comments directly to someone they are critising. Typing on a keyboard is a lot different than face-to-face contact. Maybe some of the negative posters should attend a swap meet and learn the value of seeing it live, talking with other collectors and living the experience instead of looking at a screen and making uninformed negative comments.
Enjoy the fact that members are interested enough to post positive comments, answer questions, give advise and post pictures in an effort to promote the hobby. This site has a lot of useful information, but the negative members are and will continue to drive away the veteran collectors.
Mike and Dave are correct, in my opinion. Most of you know that I am a vendor at Barrett Jackson in Scottsdale. Rory Brinkman does a great job in obtaining the items for auction. You can see them featured in this month's Petroleum Collector magazine. Most of the pieces are N.O.S and uncirculated. Top of the line stuff. The same as mentioned about the above auction as well. When an auctioneer has this quality of items, you will get the best buyers and the highest prices. Nothing wrong with that, as far as I can see. I usually mention the Barrett Jackson Automobilia auction on this site, when it is running, but did not this year. The reason is because of all the snide remarks from this panel of so called experts, in years past. This is a great forum but if you get slightly out of step, with certain members, you'll never hear the end of it. Mike said it perfectly when he invited people to get out to a show, flea market, auction,etc. to experience the real thing. If you don't like the prices, so what? I've been to many auctions and when I thought the item was too high for me, I stopped bidding. If it had been my item, selling at auction, and bringing the super dollars, you'd not hear me complain. Paul
www.severngaspumps.com
Boy did the last bunch speak for me !! I am a over restorer, but that is what my friends like me to do for them and myself. I know they did not look like that at the start or at the station, but like to make them look as good as possible IN MY EYE.
Also I think that is why we are seeing such a higher price now on pumps that are original and in such good shape. As cars survivors are making a come back because of what they represent.
Its Their money and buy the way, how many people buy big dollar guns and fishing material Only to shoot or catch something. They are not dumb, just choose what they like to spend it on.
...can't stand it...must...weigh...in...
...I, to some extent, can understand a little of both sides of this issue...I consider myself a purist, however...and stuff like this (see below) defies explanation...if these guys are too rich to learn about what they're buying, they should hire me for 1/2 of what they're overpaying for 'circus peanut wagons' (thanks, Wes - still the best description I've heard)...they'll get better stuff in their collections - and so will I...
Well there are Big dogs and little dogs,,if you wanna roll with the Big dogs, ya gotta get off the porch and stop sittin there barkin...lots of that done on this site. ( barkin ), ha,ha,,, LOL !!!!
The ole sayin, Bluebirds don't hang with the Blackbirds..so true.. We all know where we fit in..
I wish I was one of those rich dudes paying more than market value for a pump.
Gentlemen, I am just a old man trying to live off of social security so I don't think I am rich. I have come back to IG, Peotone, Oklahoma and even once drove to Knoxville to buy at auctions. Almost every thing I have bought I have overpaid for and I proudly hang them on the wall. Ask DB he is the only one of you that has seen them. He stopped and said hello last year. The reason I'll buy auctions but rarely at swapmeets is that I know that there is at least one other idiot out there that will pay just slightly less then I did. If you walk the swapmeet at the same time that I do in the afternoons and the item is still there that means the vendor is overpriced. I have a Husky can here that I overpaid for also a Frontier sign and a Husky globe. When I go to a auction it will cost me several nights in a motel at $100 a night. It cost me $800 for a set of tires for the truck. Meals in a restaurant and so on. The cost of the item I buy is minor to the overall cost but after spending the money getting there I'm not coming home without it. Mitch
...not sure what being well-informed about a subject/pastime has to do with being a 'big' or 'small' dog...and overpaying for
real quality is not always a bad thing - over the long term, it often is a good investment...I'm talking about overpaying for common stuff that will not hold its value...
...furthermore, I would dispute that spending cash like a drunken sailor on shore leave, for undeserving pieces that are over-restored (or over-valued) is good for the long term, for either the economy OR the hobby...
...the wealthy who are fortunate enough to have money to invest in the stock market, don't do so frivolously, or they aren't wealthy for long...
...any undiscerning idiot with an excess of disposable income can cover their walls and fill a building with shiny things...as do magpies and raccoons...
...and I fully understand that there are many (some right here on Oldgas) who make their livelihood by catering to the 'too rich to care' crowd, so of course they won't agree with my position...it's against their interests...
...if paying $4600 + buyers premium + sales tax for a common Gulf-spec pump imaged as a fantasy piece (with a Shell logo older than the pump itself!) makes you a 'big dog'...well, here's a video clip of just such a 'big dog'...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZCvuNbFMD4
wait a minute...what's wrong with a drunken sailor???? I resemble that remark....chuck
...I won't comment on that, other than to say that I know you're not running around buying 1965 GOC-spec pumps, restored with 1940's Shell logos for $4600+!
Wow !! Now there are some that are insulting people who work on things to make them better than original, have pride in their work and have others that like it that way too.
Ever buy or have a custom house built or do it your self? A simple two bedroom with a bath would do as it was 75 years ago! Everyone likes thing a little different and if they have money does that mean that they are real stupid or really stupid for liking it better than something else.
Lets just go with people at an auction sometimes get carried away, and I see the example and I do agree with that example as shown.
People fix trucks to ride high and look different than what was original off the show room floor, but are they not as smart as others? Or the guy that likes what he did and then does it to his truck ? Is he more stupid because he makes it just a little bit higher?
I like original and I like restored better than original, and I have people that like it also and I do not work for $5.00 per hour neither does the painter, plating person, striper, or the guy that makes the repro parts.
I probably make less than most people on here, but If I like something and I want it, it is up to me to decide if it is right for me and if I can figure out a way to get it.
It's my money, I earned it, and will spend it if IN MY MIND I think its worth it.
Scott Benjamin sold me a beautiful Standard thermometer twenty years ago that was over priced to me, but as he said sometimes you pay top money for something you want and it will go up When you buy the best. I GOT THE THERMOMETER AND HE WAS SO RIGHT THEN WITH THAT STATEMENT and it is RIGHT NOW FOR ME. I was then and am now so happy with that purchase, should have listened to him more twenty years ago though.
...not sure what being well-informed about a subject/pastime has to do with being a 'big' or 'small' dog...and overpaying for real quality is not always a bad thing - over the long term, it often is a good investment...I'm talking about overpaying for common stuff that will not hold its value...
...pretty much EXACTLY what you're saying about your Standard thermometer, right?
Yes, but I can't tell someone who likes collectibles, has the money to do so, not to do it.
Hate buying a car because I know it is going down and I will be taking a hit. Need one and do not want to be told or made fun of because I may not like the most economical. We all like things that may not make sense to others.
Hey mark..your right on that. I have overpaid here and there for stuff i have to have, but of course am always hoping for a good deal! For that price, that GOC pump better be able to...well, never mind! chuck